Another look at the Illinois deer harvest

“What is really dictating the deer harvest success of counties across the State is the amount of prime deer habitat that is found on the square miles within each county.” This whole exercise can be summed up in that one statement.  The “real” analysis that should be taking place is not how many deer per square mile are being taken, but, rather, what is the quality of the habitat that those deer are being taken from, what is the quality of the deer herd in those counties, and how many deer per permit issued in those counties are being harvested.  But, more importantly to some resident deer hunters in Illinois, how many of those deer are being taken by non-resident deer hunters, outfitters, and off of land leased to non-residents? It is said that most of huntable land in Pike County is under lease. This State has a big problem providing it’s non-land owner, resident hunters an opportunity to continue to enjoy their sport. Illinois ranks at the bottom of the States purchasing open space/land for residents on an acres/per capita basis.  Access/Illinois is not providing public hunting lands as it was intended to do.  Resident hunters are seeing their public land hunting opportunities being taken over by hordes of non-resident hunters that continue to displace resident hunters each year in drawings for hunts on Illinois public lands.  When is the IDNR and the State Legislature going to do something for the Illinois taxpayers for a change, instead of for the big insurance companies, and the big outfitters, and the well-to-do non-resident hunters?  Just once, I’d like to see an article in PSO that said that our State government was doing something for the taxpayers and voters of Illinois!

“Just once, I’d like to see an article in PSO that said that our State government was doing something for the taxpayers and voters of Illinois!”
...
It won’t happen. It’s evident they simply don’t care and never will. Illinois has been sold to the highest bidder years ago. Behind the scene deals with the FB, politicians, etc. will continue. Nothing will ever happen until the Illinois deer hunters send them a message by not purchasing deer permits for a year but that will never happen. We have no unity.

To the author: Microsoft Excel is your friend, my friend.

Marc I said that awhile back just don’t hunt for a year. But you are right most of us love to hunt so much, like you say it will never happen. But it would sure send them a message. We all said it a thousand times it’s all about the money. All we can do is go to the polls and vote and just hope we can get someone elected that gives a damm! Now theres dream for ya.

Actually, Excel would not help. Tabs do not work at all in this Web publishing program, which creates obvious headaches for all involved. At some point today I need to go back and space out the last 70 counties.

Interesting article, and certainly some food for thought there. I always like looking at Madison where I live, and see how it bounces up and down the various lists. Here it was 32 overall but dropped to 60 in harvest per square mile.
.........
The deer/vehicle collision data listed for Madison County is where it gets interesting though. Madison is #2 in terms of total collisions, but drops to #84 on the list of DVCs per billion miles driven.
.........
Reconciling these two lists I’d say we have only moderate quality habitat at best, and limited potential to control a low number of DVCs given the high number of highway miles driven (Highways 55, 70, 255. and 270 all transect Madison County).

here we go again…...

Interesting read. Thanks to the author for taking the time to calculate and provide the numbers for all the counties.

I wonder how long it will be before IDNR begins to tabulate TVC’s (Turkey vehicle collisions) Had one go through my windshield this morning

A DEER ARTICLE!!!!!! This will take the heat off the wolves real quick

Great article and thanks for the info but does it really matter what the numbers are.  Until they stop handing out so many permits and taking care of all of the out of staters the deer hunting in this state will continue to decline.  Just get on some of these websites and look at the properties people are trying to lease.  What a joke 200 acres with hedgerows on it!!!  The sad thing is there are goons out there leasing this crap for a place to hunt.  This is a direct result of the outfitters and mininmal places to hunt.  Marc as for not buying permits I am with you, but the dnr will get their money one way or the other so the out of state permits will just move up to 50,000!!  If someone comes up with a better idea we are all ears!

Rageinthecage, I’m not sure the DNR will be able to fill the shoes of several thousand nonexistent resident hunters if we stop buying permits. They haven’t filled their NR quota as of yet but they’re trying! Anyway, the sad part is we just don’t have the unity. If someone like myself tried to start something like this, the idiots would just say that it’s all about big buck hunters and start arguing. If a meat hunter started such an event, the opposite would find another reason to argue. Hunters just can’t get it together!
...
I have been just looking for places to hunt outside of the state that I deem good places but without all of the pressure. You’d be amazed how many good places there are to hunt outside of Illinois without the headaches. Illinois is a sad, sad story. It once was God’s gift to the whitetail hunter and now it’s a disaster story for its own people.
...
Illinois- Ran by crooks, sold to outsiders and raped by politicians. What a shame.

“You’d be amazed how many good places there are to hunt outside of Illinois without the headaches”
........
You can say that again :^)

Marc: “You’d be amazed how many good places there are to hunt outside of Illinois without the headaches”
........
Henry: “You can say that again :^)”
============
============
Ditto.

its people like Marc Anthony that makes the politcians in this state the state of mind not to to give anything to us taxpayers. this is supposed to be a clean site not a bitch about things site. get over it if you dont like the state move away.

“its people like Marc Anthony that makes the politcians in this state the state of mind not to to give anything to us taxpayers.”
...
Yeah, it’s all my fault. They’ll punish everyone for my remarks. Newsflash: Thye could care less about what I say as they’ve been raping Illinois years before I became vocal. Wake up!

I would gladly join the 1 year boycott

Here is link to google spreadsheets….i cleaned up numbers so you can actually read them.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AlKOGAd1brwedElXczdmMjlzUjB2SHo0SVUxRDdrU0E&hl=en

Just a thoughts about providing more opportunities to resident deer hunters regarding access to huntable lands…..

Since the Illinois Farm Bureau, and their subsidiary Country Companies Insurance, are definitely in favor of decreasing the size of the deer herd in Illinois, they should support the idea of providing more hunting opportunities to resident deer hunters.  The taxpayers are supporting the payments to farmers in Illinois to set aside their CRP lands to not grow corn and soybeans. In effect, the resident hunters have already “paid” the farmers a “lease” payment, by virtue of the farmer signing up for the government’s CRP program.  So, Obama just has to sign an Executive Order making it a condition that every farmer in Illinois taking CRP payments, to open his property up to public hunting access.  Of oourse, it wouldn’t be mandatory, the farmer still has the option of not taking the CRP payment, and not allowing the public to hunt their properties.  Of course, this would also limit the opportunities for the additional income that the farmers receive from taking the CRP payments and, at the same time, leasing their lands out to outfitters and resident/non-resident hunters. But, I’m sure that most farmers would forgo that additional income in order to achieve control over the deer herd.  So, that would make an interesting scenario, the farmers could continue to get their CRP “welfare” payments from the Federal government, but they would have to open their lands up to public hunting in order to do so.  This program could open millions of acres of private huntable lands to the public, for virtually no increase in costs of the programs as they now currently exist.  Yes, this would be a win-win situation for just about everyone.

Big D, programs like the one you mentioned aready are in place, out West. Nebraska has a program almost exactly like the one you are talking about. But there has to be a “want to by the state” I am much like the other guys on this site I don’t think they care. I have seen access to private ground in my area almost completely dry up. They need to think less about big saleries and petions and more about the people paying their salery.

Big D,
  I believe there is a similar program in place in North Dakota. If memory serves me correctly, I was able to go to Wal Mart and purchase an “atlas” of the state. The maps clearly indicated what areas were privately owned yet open to the public. When we located these areas, they were clearly marked with a sign.

BigD the net result of your proposal would of course be net loss in habitat. Why not support a cap in NR lisences instead? As an outfitter, you’re in a position to organize such a lobby.
........
Outfitters broke the cap, so maybe they can get it reinstated.

It’s really easy to see how Obama got elected. I swear, some of you people on here would believe anything.  I am amazed that any on here though that I was serious about that bunch of bullsh*t about CRP payments to landowners to allow a bunch of freeloaders with guns to run roughshod over CRP private lands.  That is the most socialistic bunch of crap that I could whip up on short notice.  I really can’t believe that anyone on here would support such a blatant violation of one’s private land rights.  In the first place, hunting is a privilege not a right.  The second Amendment of the U.S. Constitution gives everyone the right to bear arms.  There is no “Right to Hunt” Clause in the Constitution, unless you believe that hunting is “the pursuit of happiness.”  Hunting is a privilege that is granted the individual citizen by the State, based upon that “citizen” passing basic qualifications including buying a hunting license, passing a hunter safety course, drawing or buying a permit or tag, buying a habitat stamp, U.S. and State Migratory Waterfowl Stamps, obtaining a H.I.P. certification number, and possessing a F.O.I.D. card.  That just gets you legal to hunt in Illinois, that doesn’t get you a place to hunt.  If you are real lucky you live close enough to the Shawnee National Forest and can hunt on public land there, or at a nearby State Park or State Conservation Area.  Unfortunately, there just aren’t enough public lands in Illinois open to hunting to provide hunting opportunities for everyone that would like to hunt.  Access to private lands is drying up, as more and more farmers are leasing their huntable properties to Outfitters and well-to-do hunters, both resident and non-residents.  Much as you hate to admit it, hunting in America today is heading towards the label of “a rich man’s sport.”  As a Hunter Safety Instructor, I look out over those classes of young hunters that we keep graduating and wonder where all of those kids are going to hunt in the future.
I really feel sorry for them and their parents.

You said it BigD. It would be a really tough hobby to give up if one were to run out of places to hunt. I would like to think that supply-and-demand economics would tilt the table back into our favor eventually if enough hunters quit the sport and refused to make those insane lease payments on private land. But there’s a long line of jokers waiting to move in, many of them with deeper pockets than us. So that idea seems unlikely. Public access is (IMHO) the most important piece of the puzzle - even more than youth involvement. I think we’ve got enough interest in the state; we just need more (free) access for residents.

Hmm… He was for it before he was against it. I think you could have a career in politics. You can keep your gov’t given privileges and I’ll hang on to my God given rights and traditions thank you very much.

Does anyone know if outfitters have to pay for some type of outfitting license?  I’d love to see an enormous outfitter fee in this state.  Make it difficult to become a profitable outfitter.  That’s the answer.  Limit the number of NR tags and huge outfitter license fees.  On secdond thought, that’ll never happen in Illinois.  Aside from the money grab in Springfield, I really think the Outdoor Channel makes the higher-ups in Springfield feel good about their job performance.  I like watching hunting shows too, but I’m getting real tired of hunting becoming a competition.  When did hunting stop becoming an individual sport?  I liked it when I was out to please myself, not to compete with the big guys on the block.  I only own 50 acres, and I like it that way.  It makes me hunt better and pay attention to my herd health and numbers much more.  It makes it more difficult to get a nice buck after he’s been bumped a time or two.  Hell, it makes it difficult to get a doe. 

I think the public hunting land thing is a fruitless effort.  The state will never try to help hunters get more places to hunt.  I think the answer is buying property for yourself.  I know everyone can’t do that, but if enough of us do, it’ll open spots on the public ground for the non-landowners.  I kow a lot of people think they can’t afford a piece of property, but I disagree.  Most people can…especially with cost per acre falling like it is right now.  You don’t have to buy 100 or 200 acres.  Buy a small piece and work your way up.  There’s a lot of pride in owning a piece of property.  It also encourages the owner to do better by their deer.  Yes, THEIR deer.  I know the state claims they own them and legally they do, I just don’t see it like that.  I’ll be as legal as anyone else, but as soon as that deer sets foot on my property, I feel he is mine.  That mindset makes me much more concerned about it’s health and needs.  Stop waiting for the state to help you.  Obama will not pay your mortgage for you and the state of Illinois will not find you a place to hunt.

I see some good points here and Murdy is right whats wrong if the state pays a little extra to get it open to the public. No one is being forced into it.
..
What I didn’t know is that the politicians hated Marc so much they withhold stuff from the rest of us because he speaks his mind. Wow I guess we have all missed the obvious solution in all our debates. Marc needs to stop saying bad stuff so we all have a place to hunt and the politicians will do things right. Lol.
..
On a serious note I’d forgo a season to send a message, this has nothing to do with bones or meat. When you think about it we are all getting shafted the same anyway.
.. 
While I have my way of doing things and no I don’t always agree with everyone on here, everyone has the right to enjoy the sport the way they see fit as long as it’s in a legal manner and they are not intentionaly preventing anouther from doing what they enjoy. I for one welcome all opinions even if I don’t always agree.

I wish making tables were easier. That looks better.

As for firing all of them we hired them so we should be able to and we can the next time around!!

BigD you didn’t just “whip that up” as you say. It wasn’t your idea, and there are plenty of folks out there that think farmers getting that big fat govt check from the taxpayer should have to give soumething back to the taxpayer.
————
“As a Hunter Safety Instructor, I look out over those classes of young hunters that we keep graduating and wonder where all of those kids are going to hunt in the future. I really feel sorry for them and their parents.”
————
How about as an outfitter, what do you wonder then? You really Should go into politics BigD, you got the schtick down pat.
————
Andy I think there are only two alternatives. One we bring back the cap. Probably not a snowballs chance in hell of that happening unless the outfitters and farm bureau fight for it which is just one more snowball. Number two is if the DNR trashes any sense of quality in the herd statewide and Illinois’ reputation begins to suffer. That is already happening to an extent, but with the amount of land tied up there are areas the DNR has all but lost control over. I think it’s inevitable that we’re gonna look more and more like Texas (get in on a lease or hunt way overcrowded limited public land).

I remember talking to a few hunters when I was working in Texas in the 90s. Seems like pay to play had already long since entrenched itself, and it certainly hasn’t gone in reverse down there.
——-
Illinois and Texas have a couple of things in common, big bucks and mostly private property, and that combination brings out the money like flies to honey. What Illinois does NOT have are the large ranches that can outfit to rich hunters as an added profit sector to a traditional ranch business. Here in Illinois the best outfitters can do is act as a middleman tying a bunch of leases together on a shoestring, and often as not pretty drab accomodations or a motel.
——-
Eventually I think leasing will become the norm up here and a lot of the middleman outfitters will get squeezed out. Loss in the state’s reputation will help bring that about. Like I said I think thats already happening - I’m applying for gun tags in Iowa next year, taking a December DIY float trip hunt on public land, and I might head east to the Allegheny National Forest for a DIY hunt there too with OTC bow tags.

Hey how are you. I found your blog through Google and I just wanted to say that I think your writing is simply stunning! Thanks again for providing this content for free.

black mold removal

Thank you very much for sharing this information. I like this side. Its really a great article. So please give me some important information about this side.

roofing shingles

Excellent article.Its really a good article. It gives me lots of pleasure and interest. It’s a most important post. So i want to know some other details about this article. Thanks
Amphetamine Abuse

As anybody understands respect is one of the most imperative amongst people’s existence. Only respect one another to obtain along properly and I feel that leaving one’s opinion is often a behavior of respect. Do you feel so?
Narcotic Addiction

Hypotheses? Heel eel hypotheses informative: Versailles hypothermia, hypothesizes, national hypotheses quarantine, hoe in hypotheses te overgeneralize.

Amphetamine Addiction

I really salute you webmaster for having this wonderful theme and for sharing your ideas. Hop that you will continue writing more articles than this. Have a great day.

cleaning water damage

Thank you very much for posting this article. Its a very useful article. We will be acquire lot of things from this site.So i want some information about this post.

flood restoration

I am really comply with this article. It is a valuable and charming article for all. Everyone please visit this site and discus about this post each other.

Prescription Drug Abuse

Really its a good news.This site has lots of advantage. I found many interesting things from this site. I like it very much. Its so interesting.I want to sharing this topic with some of my close friends. So thanks this post.

Trazodone Abuse

Lots of thanks for this post. I think it is a very good post. It helps us many away. So many many thanks for this article.

roof

Nice to be visiting your blog again, it has been months for me. Well this article that i’ve been waited for so long. I need this article to complete my assignment in the college, and it has same topic with your article. Thanks, great share.

led lights home

Thank you very much for sharing this information. I like this side. Its really a great article. So please give me some important information about this side.

fire and water damage restoration

Good post. Thanks for sharing. Very useful for me I will bookmark this for my future needed. Thanks for a great source.

flood clean up

Wonderful facts, many thanks to the article writer. It’s understandable to me now, the usefulness and value is tremendous. Thank you once more and good luck!

energy efficient light bulbs

I like it very much. Its so kind to see it. Its a very useful article.people can easily the things you have submitted.That’s why I like the way you explain the things. Keep posting more. Thanks

flood damage

Excellent article.Its really a good website. It gives me lots of pleasure and interest. It?s a most important blog post. So i want to know some other details about this article. Thanks.

metal roofing

We are your source for free Facebook Covers. Here you will find FB Covers or Facebook Timeline Covers (whatever you call it!). We will continue to add new fb covers on a daily basis.

a href=“www.FreeTimelineCovers.net”> Facebook Covers </a>